Clan "rules"

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Lestat
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Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2016 6:39 am

Clan "rules"

Post by Lestat »

I'm gonna try a different approach and see if it gets results

I've never meant any disrespect for any GM..they do their best with what they are given(us players)

The main issue many should have issues with is the vagueness in which some rules are written.. the use of 'can be' and 'might be' leave room to question how this rule gets enforced.

There should be a way for an attacking team/clan to claim areas they conquer without it being considered spam. Otherwise we make any attempt to remove a clan(s) useless. If the area contested can only be rebuilt by clan defending, then any clan established with any level building owns that spot til they quit building ? I thought if you broke thru,removed buildings (walls should not be included here(as it takes a while for a group to take out 1k walls) then u conquered that area and could build to claim the area...it would then be the other clan job to reclaim the area...sry u can't call "mine" just cause you can build walls..

There are some issues with certain clan maps that need looked into..some maps are basically untouchable because you only have small areas you can enter. We can't believe having maps accessible from four sides, 2 sides, and then only thru small "portals/stairs" is equal ? We either need buffer zones around portals or allow open maps to build farther out.. can't make one map easy to attack and others impossible to attack and expect the ones open to attack not to complain.

I think a more defined set of rules(with an implemention date, as done with trading/sharing account) being released could ease some work on GMs. It could take some "bending" of some vague rules away by giving a more defined set of rules.

I'm sure to upset many clans and make some happy..but I'm trying to help all, and change things we all know to be true..we can't use the same tactics as our enemy and get mad.. clan is a game if war, you use the tools you have the best you can..we can't continue to cry about someone coming along with a better strategy or a better way of using your tactics against you.

If anything use this thread for your complaints on how you think clans are unfair..or if you think all is fine,say so..maybe we can see if both sides find some common ground themselves ?? It's our game it's as good as we play..if both sides give input and thoughts. All will win
lestat / sword 1038
OgreLes / ogre 2001
Loco / archer 250
-ForKotu- / mage 1143
krampdtyl / dwarf 125
Duke clans ObeY, -OC-
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SellSword
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Location: Ardesia

Re: Clan "rules"

Post by SellSword »

Zero clan experience here, but I like the idea. Actually putting something into place is of course a different issue, but discussion is good. Rules can never be so specific that they cover everything, so discussing the gaps in between can help clarify some things.
Old soldiers never die, they just fade away.
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LordSeth
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Re: Clan "rules"

Post by LordSeth »

This is what a GM inbox is for. If something is questionable send a PM to a GM we will check it if it's wrong we will let everyone know. If it's fine we will contact the clan duke and inform him or her that they have been reported but all is within the rules.

The spam buildings placed in a (occupied area) by another clan it don't matter if it's only built walls or if it's buildings of any type Especially if surrounding clans are allies helping defend the attacked base are concerned spam untill every structure of the attacked clan is gone.

At this moment multiple clan maps have clan buildings that the duke can not get to because a clan took over the location by building while the defending clan is still standing. At that time there was no available GMs or none that wanted to deal with the crying and headache if they got involved.

I'll be happy to listen to someone cry it won't hurt me a bit.

But this is in boundaries of reducing the game play of other players along with spam buildings to annoy other players. 1 tower is blocking access of a clan with several maxed towers on the map. Those players can't use the buildings and can't reach to sell them so their clan is at a point that the tag is useless.

If you want to take over a base take it completely out. Leave nothing standing so if you are successful of defeating the clan they can move on to another location if they wish.
If you constantly hunt that clan it's not agianst the rules it's part of clan warfare which every player is warned about when joining a clan.

The rules have been the same for years and yes people have trouble understanding because 95% of players do not read the rules and all the explanations of the rules just like this one untill they already violated a rule.

All it takes is alittle more time in reading you will find every rule is layed out crystal clear. But who has time to do all that reading when they have a clan to destroy or build on?

As I mentioned, if your unsure about something and don't want to take the time to search just ask a GM. We will try our best to explain anything.
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LORD SETH
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Leone
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Re: Clan "rules"

Post by Leone »

Just to pick up on your point about players not reading the rules, I have a suggestion.

We already receive system messages (10.13 / pirates at Ashdown / Marteks Stronghold) that can be easily read by all players.

Would it be possible to implement a similar system message that can only be seen by clanned players when they are on any clan map rather than normal maps?

The system message would be something like: read game rule 14 for information about spam building on clan maps.

It would then reinforce the rule and only players who need to know (ie: clanned players) would read the message.
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Lestat
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Re: Clan "rules"

Post by Lestat »

Seth since you seem intent on the ftss,rus2 issue atm...would u like to know....that's the exact tactic ftss used against HD when I was rebuilding...he built towers in an established area and proceeded to seige after...I didn't cry foul..but now someone cries and it's wrong...this is why rules need worked or people need not cry...they are having done to them exactly what they did to take the area...

reply by LordSeth> yes I'm aware of this and as I mentioned above the previous GM team was not available to intervene. I'm sorry for this and I was not able to come inform players the wrong they were doing but I was not clearly aware about it myself back then.

But we are working on it now for the (future) of current and new clans to come. If it seems unfair I'll gladly drop it all and let things be as they are. But everyone has their own opinion.
lestat / sword 1038
OgreLes / ogre 2001
Loco / archer 250
-ForKotu- / mage 1143
krampdtyl / dwarf 125
Duke clans ObeY, -OC-
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SellSword
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Re: Clan "rules"

Post by SellSword »

Lestat wrote: Mon Jul 08, 2019 1:17 pm I didn't cry foul..but now someone cries and it's wrong...
Reading this it sounds more like it was wrong then but nobody complained, and it was wrong now but somebody did complain. Whether or not someone complains doesn't determine whether or not a rule was violated.
Old soldiers never die, they just fade away.
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Lestat
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Re: Clan "rules"

Post by Lestat »

SellSword wrote: Mon Jul 08, 2019 2:28 pm
Lestat wrote: Mon Jul 08, 2019 1:17 pm I didn't cry foul..but now someone cries and it's wrong...
Reading this it sounds more like it was wrong then but nobody complained, and it was wrong now but somebody did complain. Whether or not someone complains doesn't determine whether or not a rule was violated.
Yes,but now they cry because their own tactics were/are being used AGAINST them..if they 'know' it's wrong(as they turn it in now) then they blatently broke rules and expect the "others" to be punished....

OFFICER ARREST THAT GUY...HE SOLD BETTER DOPE TO MY CRACKHEAD....

If one side does it and then cries later it's wrong, then they have admitted to the crime themselves.they should be held accountable for their actions as well..
lestat / sword 1038
OgreLes / ogre 2001
Loco / archer 250
-ForKotu- / mage 1143
krampdtyl / dwarf 125
Duke clans ObeY, -OC-
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Lestat
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Re: Clan "rules"

Post by Lestat »

But I shouldn't expect anything more from you should I Seth ?? Before u took GM...u stood outside my walls with haterz saying...' I'd have no problem helping u wipe lestat from map...'. But hey...all's good now right ? No hostility left ? I should feel absolutely fine that you'd be 'fair and impartial' to any thoughts I may have ???
This is why I get so upset at clan issues and GMs...as a duke in game..u went from an ally to enemy(without a word to me) and were preparing to help wage a war against me...and now I'm expected to believe any decisions made on any "complaints" I may make to be handled fairly and with no bias...
honestly I can't recall saying this. When I was a player for the game I had my friends and I had my enemies but I have never double crossed anyone unless I was double crossed and I never had any issues with you myself. I do recall standing on that map with h4t3rz attacking buildings that I was told was friends of the enemy clans and to be foward I mostly attended any wars was just for PvP for a chance to get gear but sadly I lost more than I gained 😂

In respect to "these have been the rules for years" comment...yes they have been...and they still get determined differently every time a complaint is made..
If Clan A did it LAST YEAR and GM X said it's no foul, and NOW Clan B does it and GM Y says it's wrong...then why have the rule at all ?? as I mentioned we are here now working on it. We are not perfect but we do what we can accordingly to the rules.

Again I say...we can't blame the GMs for a broken system..but we should blame vague rules and 'individual interpretation'. This isn't a complaint on a GM..it's a forum discussion to make both sides realize they sound like 5 yr olds fighting over 2 almost identical toys ( they both want the blue car, so they fight for it while the red car sits idle)
There would be less clan drama when each case gets handled the same..just because the location and names change(the offence is always the same) doesn't mean it gets looked at differently..this affects all sides not one,
this has been a issue for years. A monkey see monkey do type of thing if it's not given a ferm example of how it's sapose to be without crossing any lines leading to a violation.

But hey, accounts still get shared,people still scam,and clans will continue to push limits. The crybabies will cry and so on and so on..the game will continue, that has been proven. The only question that remains is..will it get better or get worse ? yes you are correct there is still alot of rules being broken and it has improved alot since the time of no GMs to new GMs we are hoping to clear things up but in this process there is alot of time and work involved and we all have responsibilities other than the game. I'm not sure if anybody noticed but we are working on it.
lestat / sword 1038
OgreLes / ogre 2001
Loco / archer 250
-ForKotu- / mage 1143
krampdtyl / dwarf 125
Duke clans ObeY, -OC-
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LordSeth
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Location: Blood Palace

Re: Clan "rules"

Post by LordSeth »

Leone wrote: Mon Jul 08, 2019 12:51 pm Just to pick up on your point about players not reading the rules, I have a suggestion.

We already receive system messages (10.13 / pirates at Ashdown / Marteks Stronghold) that can be easily read by all players.

Would it be possible to implement a similar system message that can only be seen by clanned players when they are on any clan map rather than normal maps?

The system message would be something like: read game rule 14 for information about spam building on clan maps.

It would then reinforce the rule and only players who need to know (ie: clanned players) would read the message.
This would be possible but difficult to implement for only clan members however it would not be difficult on only clan maps. I will talk about this with compbatant.
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LORD SETH
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Lestat
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Re: Clan "rules"

Post by Lestat »

First to Seth, thanks I like the editing into my post..easier to understand.

Now on to a few other things..if to build without being spam...

We have to: 1 clear the entire clan from before
2 be allied to map ???
3 cannot be duke of another clan with builds
on a separate map( but having more than
one clan on map is ??)

the issue will be #2. This basically gives the "map" control...what's to stop a "map" from breaking ally and requesting the now unallied clan be removed as they are not allied and no longer wanted on map ?? I think this might need more detail or explanation..as it leaves much room for question..more so than using "could be considered" and to make the rules on spam clans more direct the "could be considered" should read "will be considered" this removes that gray area everyone keeps testing..

On a final note.. this is what forum threads are for..let's get a conversation going and clear the gray areas. Don't jump on GMs for doing what they feel is best..(yes I make statements) and rarely use any names .. I may question a decision just to get a better understanding of why it's the one made. But I won't call someone out on heresay. I do tend to exaggerate numbers(years of being in clans and hearing these issues over and over may lend to that), but it's just trying to prove a point...I think everyone should spend a week in a clan losing a battle and a week in a clan trying to seige , this gives those who don't want clan( their decision to make and I respect that) a better insight to our frustrations.

I think we are making progress and GMs should be commended on their efforts.
lestat / sword 1038
OgreLes / ogre 2001
Loco / archer 250
-ForKotu- / mage 1143
krampdtyl / dwarf 125
Duke clans ObeY, -OC-
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