Ryaca wrote:I want to say something. I know that there are differences of opinion on this subject. I also want to say that there are players weighing in on this topic that have little to no experience in PvP with a high level mage (3k+) much less have a mage account that is 3k or higher so I believe their comments to be very naive. Now I've heard all the arguments, : mages spell damage is reduced by 50% in PvP, non-mage classes have gear that can give 95% spell resist(they fail to Mention that not every player has this gear but they try to deal in absolutes by making it sound like every player in the game has 95% spell resist gear), and my all time favorite, : players block my heal and use sieges as shields so mages are completely powerless and defenseless. I agree that players should NEVER be able to use sieges as shields. This is something that I cannot believe someone thought was even remotely reasonable to develop and put into the game(let's use an idea a five year old would find rational to put into the game). I disagree that mages ALWAYS HAVE HEAL BLOCKERS AROUND. When mages attack me (happens quite a bit) I am alone, so no heal blocking there, and they HEAL THEMSELVES JUST FINE IN THOSE MOMENTS, but mages try to make it seem like the scenarios they describe are absolutely all the time, trying to twist and spin the truth to suit their agenda. My advice is this, if you have never played a mage level 3k or higher or never fought a mage level 3k or higher, then you really have no idea what you are taking about and you obviously have not seen how ungodly powerful a mage is at that level or higher. A self healing mage spell... Give me a freaking break! Shaking my head and trying not to let the insanity infect me.
Alright, you sound heated... with good reason.
The big issue here is, everyone is only seeing this from their own limited point of view.... including myself.
No, I've never used a 3k+ mage. No, I don't do PvP much - except in self defense (
almost like a rule or something...)
In my specific case,
there is no one who could tell me I should not have a self heal spell. My mage is primarily a healer - that's what he does. He almost never has pets (unless I'm possibly crafting or doing a specific quest), but even when he does - he'll NEVER have sieges...
On occasion, I get some player-killer after my gear. Most often, when I'm in a crowd of lows tanking, surrounded by mobs and the players I'm protecting. Now here I have only few choices - I can try to fight, but healing myself is almost impossible. I can try to run, but that would likely get the low guys killed. Usually what I do is, try to kill the mobs, then unequip before I die. Hopefully, I can do this quick enough. Dying with honour, saving the new players, and hopefully my gear too. Xp is a small sacrifice.
Your case is talking about only higher level PvP - 3k+.
As you describe, and with all the "tricks" you list, sure, it makes perfect sense that
a mage should NOT have a self heal spell. They're OP as it is. The siege thing is stupid, yes, and should be reworked completely, I agree. Of course, these higher level mages are PvP oriented (why else would you buy the levels?), and so most (if not all) will use the siege tactic to their advantage.
For all the others - they're all at various levels, and have different cases. Many are clanned and participate in PvP. Some are casual PvM players. We're also hearing from just about every type of class user. They all have differing views, based on who've they've faced, and what tricks they use.
This comes down to a base problem I mentioned in another thread. It's how the offensive power of a mage rises as they gain in level. It's a multiplication function. All other classes are linear. As long as this fact exists, balancing is nearly impossible...
I still think a self heal option should be available. Ultimately, a mage should be allowed to target who they want to heal, similar to how they target who they want to attack. You mention insanity? This idea is completely logical - if you simply consider the idea of what a mage can do in any rpg. It only gets messy when you apply it to the current state of mechanics. When you do that.... yes, I agree, high level mages having self heal would likely be a bad idea.
Also, I've mentioned your point about gear and spell resistance in the other thread - I myself will likely never have it or use it - that's again, my case, not everyone's.
It is highly improbable at this point that we can all agree on a strategy that will work. The only way it could is that if
the self heal actually got weaker as a mage levels up. That might work. The higher your mana, the weaker the self heal. If any number-crunchers here want to take a crack at that one... go ahead.
Honestly though... I would go back the
specialist idea... at a certain level (I'll say 500, only because I'm over it LOL), you have 3 choices. This would go for all classes, but let's focus on mage. You can go to one of two trainers, and "specialize" your class. If you choose a healer, you get self heal, maybe a stronger group heal, but serious PvP penalties to your abilities (especially offensive). PvM could be affected a little... but not as much as PvP. If you choose the offensive mage, you get another attack spell instead maybe - red flow? don't matter... what it does exactly, others can figure out and decide (I wanna be a healer)... but you may get a PvP boost (to be discussed), but a serious penalty on defensive spells (not just heal, but armor too), and definitely no self heal spell. There may (or may not) be a general stat boost to specializing. Of course, your 3rd option is to stay "generic". Similar options to specialize should be available to all classes, with a new skill for each (...and while we are at it... how about other classes equipping/unequipping skills? if you don't use them, why do they need to block your screen?)
Anyway... with this idea... if you want the self heal spell, you'll take a PvP nerf... if you want a PvP bonus, you'll get a heal (and armor spell) nerf... or you could just stay the way you are. I would like the stat boost though, as I would like to try and encourage all to specialize over being generic.
Here's another great point - if specialist classes are introduced - they could potentially work on completely different formulae - more balanced ones. If you make specializing a class more favourable over being generic - through stat bonuses, spell/skill additions, and possibly an overall large advantage over generic - you'll be encouraging all to choose the more balanced PvP formulae.
As for all the numbers, how it would work exactly and all that - well I'd leave number-crunching to the experts, and contributions to the community.
