Player killing by spawn is against the rules?

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Nilez
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Player killing by spawn is against the rules?

Post by Nilez » Fri Mar 24, 2017 8:35 am

Okay, so I've heard that player killing by spawn is against the rules. I have a problem with that. PLEASE READ 'FULLY' BEFORE JUDGING.

We're sick of the rules in real life and the limits were put up against. We come onto an MMORPG to get away from real life. We don't want to be hounded by more rules here.
I was told that a game is defined by it's rules. To which I retorted saying, a game is defined by how fun it can be.

So my point of view/opinion is that if someone kills another player via spawns 3 times or more, call it harassment and punish them. If someone kills a bunch of players via spawns, punish them. Doing it once or twice, to random people, just for fun should be okay, so long as you're not targeting someone/harassing a bunch of players.

Isn't spawn killing, just another way of using the game mechanics? Killing is allowed, what form it takes shouldn't be important (again, unless people are being harassed).
Too many rules takes away the fun. Rules are important, I just think they need some adjustments.

Maybe allow it twice per month? Idk, let's discuss.

I was suggested to take it to the forums and have a debate.
("An open debate about rules is always very interesting and leading everyone knowing them better - and of course it helps rules evolution sometimes")
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ardesia
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Re: Player killing by spawn is against the rules?

Post by ardesia » Fri Mar 24, 2017 9:18 am

I'm glad you posted it, Nilez.
I'm replying just to clarify - to those reading your post not knowing the chatting we had on this topic - that by stating "an open debate about rules is always interesting" I'm not implying rules are easily open to be modified :)

What I mean is that everyone needs to have a good understanding of rules.
In case someone - as you do - doesn't understand why a rule is stated as it is, sharing the question and its answering can lead everyone to a better understanding.

About the spawn killing players. You are proposing to have rules allow it once in a while.
Let me say, I disagree.
Spawn killing players is not fun, at least not for the killed ones - the ones the rule wants to protect.
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Leone
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Re: Player killing by spawn is against the rules?

Post by Leone » Fri Mar 24, 2017 9:35 am

Let me propose a counter argument then.

If spawn killing is deemed acceptable and not reducing the gaming experience of others, then the perpetrators should be placed on the victim's kill list, just as if they had directly attacked them in pvp.
blitzcraig
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Re: Player killing by spawn is against the rules?

Post by blitzcraig » Fri Mar 24, 2017 9:38 am

Your idea of doing it rarely, or "once-in-a-while" or twice a month may sound fun to you, and not cross over into harassment... but what would actually happen if such a rule was in place is that twenty players would use this "rare" event once per day with 25 alts each - leading to 500 spawn kill events every day. And frankly, that's being overly nice... because in reality, they'd do it 10 times each on each alt and when they got caught, they'd claim it was once or twice... eventually the 5,000 times a day that it would happen just from this tiny group of people whom derive their enjoyment from making others miserable would drive more and more players to quit. Additionally, as you said, "a game is defined by how fun it can be" and yet, it seems as though you selfishly desire to reduce the fun of everybody else so that you can get a bit more for yourself...if that's the case, it's pathetic. To my knowledge, I have never - literally not one time ever suggested this to an FT player before, but perhaps if making others miserable is the only way you can have fun, you should find something else to do with your time... FT is better off without you

If, on the other hand, you aren't looking to make others miserable, rather, you are simply looking for a way to make the game better for everybody, then I'd suggest this is not the way to do it - keep thinking of ideas and sharing them like this to be discussed ;)

EDIT - upon rereading my post, I realize it seems that the "ifs" seem somewhat disingenuous.. that was not my intent - because you brought this to the forum respectfully, I'm assuming you are a good person, and my original post did not reflect that assumption - I am leaving it as I wrote it, because I believe it accurately expresses my feelings on the issue :D
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Leone
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Re: Player killing by spawn is against the rules?

Post by Leone » Fri Mar 24, 2017 10:06 am

Well said blitz. I'd have left the edit out tbh.
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naomi
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Re: Player killing by spawn is against the rules?

Post by naomi » Fri Mar 24, 2017 10:07 am

i hate spawn killers..no excuses, i want them to be outlaw immediately :D
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Leone
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Re: Player killing by spawn is against the rules?

Post by Leone » Fri Mar 24, 2017 11:00 am

naomi wrote:i hate spawn killers..no excuses, i want them to be outlaw immediately :D
Now there's a thought. Perhaps not instant outlaw but certainly towards yr outlaw count?
Nilez
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Re: Player killing by spawn is against the rules?

Post by Nilez » Fri Mar 24, 2017 2:49 pm

blitzcraig wrote:Your idea of doing it rarely, or "once-in-a-while" or twice a month may sound fun to you, and not cross over into harassment... but what would actually happen if such a rule was in place is that twenty players would use this "rare" event once per day with 25 alts each - leading to 500 spawn kill events every day. And frankly, that's being overly nice... because in reality, they'd do it 10 times each on each alt and when they got caught, they'd claim it was once or twice... eventually the 5,000 times a day that it would happen just from this tiny group of people whom derive their enjoyment from making others miserable would drive more and more players to quit. Additionally, as you said, "a game is defined by how fun it can be" and yet, it seems as though you selfishly desire to reduce the fun of everybody else so that you can get a bit more for yourself...if that's the case, it's pathetic. To my knowledge, I have never - literally not one time ever suggested this to an FT player before, but perhaps if making others miserable is the only way you can have fun, you should find something else to do with your time... FT is better off without you

If, on the other hand, you aren't looking to make others miserable, rather, you are simply looking for a way to make the game better for everybody, then I'd suggest this is not the way to do it - keep thinking of ideas and sharing them like this to be discussed ;)

EDIT - upon rereading my post, I realize it seems that the "ifs" seem somewhat disingenuous.. that was not my intent - because you brought this to the forum respectfully, I'm assuming you are a good person, and my original post did not reflect that assumption - I am leaving it as I wrote it, because I believe it accurately expresses my feelings on the issue :D
No offence intended.

Your example said one thing, I did mention the idea of having a limit, like twice a month. So those same 20 people with their 25 alts(which I don't even know why this game allows (limit on this?)) Would kill about 1000 times a month.

The game mechanics allow it, but in a game of killing thousands of monsters, destroying buildings, etc, killing by spawn is something (I'm assuming afk'ers for example, but not limited to) dislike, cuz it gets in their way. Surely if you are active enough, you could keep out off harm's way, run away from ppl like these, or just kill them yourselves. Right, why don't you kill such ppl in game? With the little attack button. (Are their levels a little too low that you aren't allowed to attack them, while they couldn't possibly match up to your 2k or 3k levels and would have to find different means to attack you, and if you died, that method of killing must be banned). Or they'd have to grind for another year or two, just to be able to kill you.

Surely, if you went adventuring out into the wild, you'd expect thieves to just let you walk by, it's just realistic that they wouldn't stop you, cuz they don't want to go to jail. When does it get any realistic? You kill thousands of monsters, but you don't want to be killed yourself? By a feature of the game.

You don't like spawn killers, so it should be outlawed?

Sure, let me just attack this 2000 level player and die an instant death. (Who has most likely purchased the experience?)
Nilez
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Re: Player killing by spawn is against the rules?

Post by Nilez » Fri Mar 24, 2017 2:51 pm

naomi wrote:i hate spawn killers..no excuses, i want them to be outlaw immediately :D
I hate this, so it should be outlawed. I hate that, so it should be outlawed as well.
Nilez
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Re: Player killing by spawn is against the rules?

Post by Nilez » Fri Mar 24, 2017 3:00 pm

Leone wrote:Let me propose a counter argument then.

If spawn killing is deemed acceptable and not reducing the gaming experience of others, then the perpetrators should be placed on the victim's kill list, just as if they had directly attacked them in pvp.
And the victims could attack the perpetrators anytime they wished (within a week) regardless of their level difference.

Is your idea of a kill list different from that?

P.S.
Idk what events follow when you attack a person directly. Everyone's either been too strong or too weak for me to attack.
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